[RMVXAce] Working Title

[legacyblade]

I thought that's how you pronounced it too. I think he's having trouble with the length of it though.

[tSwitch]

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NUMBER 6: What NOT to name your game!

Pretentious Monotony: Cacaphony of the Derelict
Crystal Fantasy Tales 2: The Dragon's Star
AWESOME POSSUM KICKS DOCTOR MACHINO'S BUTT!
Macrophallic Epicaricacy I: Schizothemia

I sure hope you can tell that those are BAD examples of Game Titles.
General Rules to Follow:

1) Don't use the words Eternal, Crystal, Tales, Magic, Fantasy, Dragon, Darkness, Light, Legend, God, Divine, etc...
they've been used SO MANY TIMES it has become absolutely disgusting to see another game named
Fantasy of the Dark Crystal Song.

2) IF IT TAKES LONGER TO PRONOUNCE THE NAME OF YOUR GAME THAN IT DOES TO CLICK ON THE TOPIC, YOU'RE DOING SOMETHING WRONG!

3) Don't use Big words in an attempt to sound smart or mysterious.  It just makes you sound like an asshole.

4) Short, sweet, simple is the best.  With some relevance to the game. 
Sometimes Latin works, or Japanese, maybe Spanish.

Just make it sound GOOD.  Don't try to make it sound SMART, and don't use the aforementioned cliche words of RPG-ness.

also: thank Holk of RMRK for oompiling that list of overused game title words,
and offering a guide on game titles (this is a short summary/build off of his post)


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[Calintz]

It's a four syllable word.
It isn't too long.

[legacyblade]

Aye, I've known a lot of popular games with longer names. "Baten Kaitos: Eternal Wings and the Lost Ocean."

[tSwitch]

my point is the title is inflated (do you even -need- the subtitle? is this a series or something?) and not only that but it's a word with no definition and it looks confusing, much less is it confusing to pronounce without first being told how to (wuh-root-ear-huh-rhioos? wu-teahr-ee-uhs? w-ruh-tea-rhioos?), which is why it's not necessarily a good title. 

I think point #3 applies the most here, it's a long word that doesn't exist in any known language with confusing and possibly ambiguous pronunciation.  That's my point, in all its simplicity. Needless overcomplication.  That's why I (personally) think it's a bad choice for a title.

also LB, just because some pro game did it, doesn't mean it's a good idea.

**I make exception for games which have games for good reason, usually for comedic value (such as "AaaaaAAaaaAAAaaAAAAaAAAAA!!! - A Reckless Disregard for Gravity)

[legacyblade]

Not to be rude or anything, but you're quoting yourself as an attempt to appeal to the authority. It just doesn't work. And while I don't think just because a pro does it means it's ok, I also don't think an inde game maker's opinion is the ultimate source of truth on a matter. So stop giving him crap, it's his game and he can title it as he wishes.

[Calintz]

@Legacyblade:
Thank you.. .. ..

@NAMKOR:
You're absolutely wrong.
Just because you won't find the word in an english dictionary alongside a definition doesn't mean it has no value. "Wrutearius" is the name of the planet that the game takes place on. A fantasy world.. .. ..and being a fantasy (not real) world, I can't see a good reason to name the planet based on a sum of words to be found in an english dictionary. I'm not going out on a limb here to create my own grammar rules to justify its use; I'm using english grammar principles to create something unique that connects to the work.

The subtitle "Well in the Woods" pertains to the bond between earth and the fantasy world.
Every word in the title of this game has been carefully thought out and bears a direct relation to the story in some way.

And I don't mean to be a prick here, but just because some people may or may not have more difficulty with pronunciation and grammar than others, that doesn't give them the right to shun on a person's creative work. There is truly nothing complicated about this word.

WRU (write)
TEAR (teardrop)
IUS (self-explanitory)

All principles used to create this word come from english grammar and can be found in thousands of words in the english dictionary. Using one's knowledge to be creative does not "overly complicate" things. Especially when the product is a simple 4syllable word.

[legacyblade]

While I agree with what you said, I think a way you could possibly improve the ease at which the name can be pronounced (I had to stop and read through it), is to change the spelling to Reutearius. That doesn't look as cool, but it is a bit easier. But still, it's a fantasy word, it doesn't have to look like the word "pie" to be a good title, so whatever you like best. It's your title.

[winkio]

I'm not going to say that you can't use that name for you game, I'm just going to say that it's not very catchy.  It's not a title that you can easily say in conversation, and it is also visually confusing.  Because of both of those factors, it is not going to get as much attention as it would otherwise.

The best names for games are based around one two syllable word: zelda, halo, metroid, etc.  Of course, you can have other words around it, but a two syllable word is the most memorable (also evidenced outside of gaming: starbucks, walmart, apple, etc.)  Of course, sometimes, it's a 3 syllable word instead, but it still can be said very easily and is recognizable.

Also, could everyone stop taking everything so personally?

[legacyblade]

Were we taking things personally? 

But I do agree with you winkio, the title isn't very catchy. Well in the woods is catchy, but Wruterius isn't. Personally, however, I find three sylable words to be more catchy, provided it's a made up fantasy-ish name (tales of...arcadia, symphonia, phantasia, etc.)

[tSwitch]

regardless of if it's simple to you, if I gave the word 'Wrutearius' to a randomly selected group of 50 people, I'm pretty sure most of them would pronounce it wrong, or not even try.  

Not to mention the fact that English pronunciation rules aren't universal either.  For example tear and tear are two different words, one means a small orb of water that falls from one's eye, the other is a rip, or to rip.  Spelled the same, but one is pronounced 'teer' and one is pronounced 'tair.'  English is a needlessly complex language, making it nearly impossible to mix and match rules to make something sound interesting without making it ambiguous at the same time.

It has nothing to do with having more difficulty with grammar and pronunciation and everything to do with the fact that English is the most redundant, complex, and ambiguous language in the world, which makes things like this even more complicated.

I'm not going to say that you can't use that name for you game, I'm just going to say that it's not very catchy.  It's not a title that you can easily say in conversation, and it is also visually confusing.  Because of both of those factors, it is not going to get as much attention as it would otherwise.

Exactly.  Your title is the first impression you give people.  If nobody knows anything about your game and sees "Wrutearius: The Well in the Woods" that's all they know about your game.  They don't know it's the name of the world, they don't know The Well in the Woods is some kind of metaphorical bond between earth and the world, they don't know -anything- except a title.  The title needs to pull in the player, interest them into reading further, to find out more about your game.  That's why it needs to be catchy, easy to read, and easy to pronounce.  The same as with any logo, it should be memorable, not complex.

But I do agree with you winkio, the title isn't very catchy. Well in the woods is catchy, but Wruterius isn't. Personally, however, I find three sylable words to be more catchy, provided it's a made up fantasy-ish name (tales of...arcadia, symphonia, phantasia, etc.)

Arcadia isn't a mad up word
Symphonia isn't a made up word
Phantasia isn't a made up word

Oh yeah, and I don't appreciate my integrity being attacked LB.  I didn't quote my topic to try and throw my SMod badge around like I'm some kind of gaming demogod with an ego as big as a Zepplin.  I just didn't want to type it a second time, and figured it'd be more useful to quote it, rather than just linking to it.

Lastly, some positive with a nut of negative, the story looks pretty neat everything else aside, and could very well be something unique and fun to play if made properly.  But the 'teenage hero' thing is getting kind of dry and overdone, not to mention that I have a 13 year old little brother and there's no way he could realistically go on a monster hunting adventure in his sweatshirt.  But I suppose realism isn't really the point so it's just a point of believability.

Disclaimer: No part of the above post was written in anger or with negative intent by the poster, it is merely to be considered the poster's input and absolute opinion on the matter, and is to be read as such.  The poster simply intends to attempt to give advice on the subject gained through experience and study, and is not the word of law so much as what he feels to be a good piece of advice to help advance a fellow indie game developer's project.

[legacyblade]

Oh, didn't know those weren't made up words. 

And I wasn't trying to challenge your integrity, it just seemed like you were quoting yourself as an appeal to the authority. And it really bothers me when people create their own standard and try and force it on everyone else (SDK anyone?). I also wrote that post at like three in the morning, so I sounded a bit snappy. I do agree that the title is a bit hard to read. But after the multitude of fantasy books I've read, I'm good at getting through names like Okri'sh'n'nu'gangunuwrugandetu and alendrasivanianitarium, so I'm a bit desensitized. I think, though, if calintz likes the title, we should just accept that, ya know? I mean it's his game, the first impression should match what he wants it to be. (even if said first impression includes a word most likely to be skipped over or read as "wer i tus" (how most of my friends pronounced it at first glance, when they didn't say "w...that word")

[Calintz]

I won't argue over this any longer.. .. ..
This isn't a commercial project to be viewed and played by thousands.

It's a simple RPG created by a fan of fantasy for a small number of people on a forum.
I apologize if the title is hard to read. I excelled in english class, and reading and grammar comes easy to me.

I assumed(perhaps my fault) that most would be able to read the title without any problems what-so-ever, and even now, I still believe many of you used overly exaggerated examples to validate your reasons. The pronunciation attempts listed are more likely to be made by 2 and 3graders, not by kids with a high school reading level. I'm being 100% honest when I say that I don't know a single person who sees the letters (WR) side by side and tries to pronounce the W before the R.

The only real pronunciation trouble that I can even possibly see being a problem is the (TEAR) section, because I could imagine some people wanting to pronounce the word as tear(tear drop) or possibly tear(tearing paper). Everything else is 100% standard and visually self-explanatory.

So, I guess the only thing I can do is to apologize to those who experience difficulty reading the title of my game.
If it would please you, pretend it isn't there, and skip right to "Well in the Woods," but the name stays as is.. .. ..

Thanks to NAMKOR and the rest for this wonderful deliberation.
I realize that you were only trying to help me see that I "may or may not" have made a simple "promotion" error if you will, but I simply disagree. I was open to your points, but they just don't drive home. Wrutearius it is.. .. ..

[Subsonic_Noise]

To end this discussion, I think the title is catchy and knew how to pronounce it from when I first saw it. And I'm german. Take that. lol

Also, this looks interesting. I may not be a really good beta tester, but could I test it when the demo is out?

[fugibo]

I'm just gonna say that I don't feel "Wrutearius" goes very well with "The Well in the Woods," but that's just me, and I can't come up with anything better myself. But it doesn't give me the vibe I'm thinking TWitW does.

Also, I remember way back when all of your stuff was Bridge to Terabithia inspired. That was forever ago, eh?

[Calintz]

Yeah, Lol.. .. ..
I kinda surprised you remembered that, and it still basically is.

Yes, you can beta test the DEMO.

[legacyblade]

I remember the first demo you put out too And I just realized I hadn't commented on the battle system screenshot I saw. Gotta say, twas awesome.

[Ilitsa]

Just wanted to say this sounds pretty interesting, and I really like the title ^^

[Calintz]

update of the back story has been posted. this project is not dead.