Animal Rights

[Rune]

What are people's views on the matter?

In my own opinion, animals should not be treated the way they are. Experiments carried out involving household cleaners or similar products are unnecessary, as the reaction may be different to humans from what effects they have on animals. I've seen some rather frightening images of animals in states like this, and would just like to ask, if this was you in their state, how would you feel?

Secondly, meat. Yes, I am a meat eater, though I'm nowhere near proud of it. The thought of eating something that was once a living creature sickens me. I refuse to eat meat off my own back, but if it's there on my plate, then I will eat it. When I move out, I plan to become a Vegetarian, no matter what anyone else tells me.

I have many other points, but I want to hear other people's opinions on the matter.

[Starrodkirby86]

If the experiments are purposely inhumane, then it should be eradicated. Animals are usually test subjects to benefit ourselves in technology. Without them at the least, our human kind would definitely be smaller than it should...or at least more drugged up. Animals themselves are great beings...Just...*sigh* It is depressing. :\ I'm
for the animal testing part though.

In meat, there was recently the infamous Downer Cow video...That poor cow! Its eye got poked by the thing...and it had to die.  THAT's inhumane. :/

[Rune]

Spraying substances in a rabbit's eyes, for instance, is inhumane. Why can't we just use humans? Dead ones, of course, I wouldn't want humans to suffer any more or less than animals do. We just use animals because they can't say "No".

Also, I don't believe I've seen that Downer Cow video, I might search sometime, but I'm afraid that I'd be scarred for life.

[Starrodkirby86]

True, but where can you find dead humans besides that one donating place? And that place is mainly for forensics, medical stuff, and Las Vegas's Body Works exhibit. And animals are alive, so the reaction is seen and notice unlike a dead human where we don't know what happens from the pain and etc. (The pain that isn't noticeable).

The Downer Cow video is about the mistreatment of a Downer Cow from an employee of the Hallmark Meat Company. The president I believe said, "I would not eat from that cow." yet that slaughtered it while the cow was already in deep pain. The video was completely horrible. I'll describe it. The Downer Cow couldn't even start walking before its death, so the pushing crane machine-a-ma-bobber tipped the cow down. The cow fell. The machine tried to pick it up, damaging and permanently ruining an eye I believe. The cow was struggling as the car kept kicking it towards the slaughter house. Painful.

[DeathLock]

Using dead humans for experimental will not show the side effects. Its a sacrifice we must make, even though its morally wrong. Humans use animals, because we are some what superior than them. Its a survival, you'll have to accept that it is a way of life. Humans will not change, we care about ourselves but not others. Its human nature.

Animal rights doesn't really exist, humans have dominated the land and will destroy it. We can fight it, but we cannot stop it.

[GAX]

Well, I do believe in many cases in Animal Rights, and that we shouldnt' treat many animals the way we do.

I think my neighbor made a good sum up of how he saw killing animals in that if it's done for survival (food) without being reckless, then that is okay.  But, experimenting on animals and hunting for sport are two things I really don't agree with, it's actually kinda sickenning to me that people will kill an animal and stuff it full of wax or whatever just to have a decoration, or that people will test medication and such on animals.

As I said already, I do believe in hunting and raising some animals for food, but it should be something carefully done, not just mass slaughters.  I've seen the Downer Cow video, as well as many videos shown to me by friends who are part of PETA, and I've argued with them about my own diet (I keep a mix, I still eat meat but I do enjoy some vegitarian and even vegan foods).  I'll admit that the Downer Cow video did sicken me a bit, I actually did not eat any beef for a good week until after I saw the video, just as I did not buy any chicken food from KFC when I saw the Kentucky Fried Cruely video.

This topic in whole can cover quite a wide variety though...I'll stop in to see how it grows.

[Blizzard]

I find it rather interesting how people always use the term "inhuman" to describe such behavior where I haven't seen anything like that from something that is not human. I would say exactly that IS human behavior as humans are the most selfish and arrogant race on this planet and the only race that tortures other creatures for fun.

I, personally, am against experiments on animals out of similar reasons that were stated already. Animals can't say "No" and can't defend themselves as they lack the ability to comprehend their situation. I am pretty sure that mankind has enough understanding of chemics that they could simply foretell the chemical reactions through research. But this requires more time and more money which those corp. assholes are not ready to invest.

But then again raising animals for food is a necessity. The number of people is growing and more people need more food so mass production of food is unavoidable since humans actually ignore the rule "the fittest will survive" and allow anybody to be alive. Don't get me wrong, these are the facts, I'm not encouraging "killing all low-life people" or something like that.

Animal rights is a pretty abstract term as is human rights. In fact, what gives us humans the right to torture and abuse other living creatures? Because we can?! Sorry, that's no answer for me. If we really can do something like that, then this "big power" gives as an equally big responsibility (yeah, yeah, I know, but it's a very wise saying, probably the wisest saying of all of them...). We are all "god's creatures" or better said, we all live on this planet and can't survive without each other (even though I'm sure animals would survive pretty well without us). If there were no animals, we humans would starve, wouldn't we? We should respect every animal we eat as it ensures our own survival. That's why I also agree with GAX: raising for food, yes; mass slaughter, no.
I don't feel bad about eating meat. After all if I would have found myself somewhere in Africa with a hungry lion, I don't think that the lion would hesitate to attack, kill and eat me for his survival. But using animals for experiments or even torturing them for fun is just cruel. Such people deserve to experience the suffering they cause.

[Rune]

If there were no animals, humans would have evolved in such a way that we'd become Herbivores. We're Omnivores, meaning that we can eat both meat and vegetables, so why can't we just resort to one? Some people say that we can't survive without one or the other. Bollocks. Vegetarians and Vegans manage to live off vegetables and meat alternatives, which gives proof that there is nothing stopping humans from just resorting to vegetarianism.

[Starrodkirby86]

If there were no animals, humans would have evolved in such a way that we'd become Herbivores. We're Omnivores, meaning that we can eat both meat and vegetables, so why can't we just resort to one? Some people say that we can't survive without one or the other. Bollocks. Vegetarians and Vegans manage to live off vegetables and meat alternatives, which gives proof that there is nothing stopping humans from just resorting to vegetarianism.

I agree. Humans are very adaptable. But the people who are saying we cannot live without one sort of food source are saying that because they're strongly attached to it, and if they leave that food source then their bodies would start making side-effects, kind of like Drug Addiction. And Rune, you said Bollocks! <3

[Blizzard]

Hm, that's true, people eat everything. Well, to be honest, I would starve. ._. I eat a lot of meat because I get hungry to quickly otherwise. I eat vegetables and fruits of course, I love fresh vegetables and fruits. <3 But to have a balanced meal without meat is somewhat complicated not just for me, but especially for me because I hate Soya, lol!

[Starrodkirby86]

If every person began life only eating vegetables, and they start eating meat and no longer vegetables later in life (Once they get very used to the nutrients of fruit and veggies), then the body would produce so much side-effects. This is because the body is not used to the unknown new food I would assume. xD

Myself, I am a balance of both, but I would have a side of meat for cases like salad and many other vegetables. However, usual fruit and some veggies like corn I don't need any meat. If I do not have meat, some of the planted stuff would be tasteless for me...*sigh*

It's true that we humans have wiped off a heckuva lotta species off the face of the Earth. We should deserve to have some death for that. But we must live on anyway, or live what we can. After all, we can ownzorz the animals, but an asteroid coming here can ownzorz us...

[Rune]

An asteroid has no sense of direction though, Humans do. We choose to exploit animals for our own use, an asteroid follows the path it is always in, unless something forces it to change (think orbiting or something), like a train for instance. Trains go wherever their rails take them, Humans have no rails or guidelines, giving us the choice, yet we still choose to senselessly slaughter animals for our own gain.

I'd probably think less on the matter if the deaths of the animals weren't so violent, and painful, but, for example, beheading a chicken and watching it run around for a while before eventually falling over and becoming motionless just sickens me.

[Starrodkirby86]

That would be funny if it was on a cartoon, but not in reality. The poor chicken dies because you cut its head off...that's depressing.  There are humans at least trying to preserve our species and against it, and I don't mean those PETA freaks. It's just that we use animals as slaves or property. Oh gosh, I don't want this to delve into a debate of racism and the color line, so I'll just talk more about animals.

The asteroid thing was kind of a joke, but it shows how little power we have (Other than decision, and all of that stuff). Some people enjoy bloody gore and etc. (Not going to point fingers), and if they want to see deaths of an animal (If that pleasures them), then they are sick...but that's the human mind. Such a fickly thing.

[Rune]

It won't turn into a debate about racism, we do use Animals as slaves and such. Take Circuses for example. I don't see how people can get entertainment out of making animals do potentially dangerous stunts, such as balancing on a highwire, or making elephants stand on one foot. I'm just waiting for the day when someone shoves his head in a Circus Lion's mouth and gets it bitten off. That's about as far as my sick pleasures go. Revenge.

[Starrodkirby86]

Not to be off-topic, but if you want revenge, I recall a show on Animal Planet where it has something along the lines of "When Animals Attack". The commercial had a lot of abuse on humans from animals which were unexpected. Some of the most memorable ones were a kangaroo beating up some person and a reporter getting kicked by a rhinoceros.

That reminds me also of a tragic story in a San Diego Zoo this year (Thanks to my Wii News Channel  ). A group of drunk teenagers/young adults were nearby a tiger cage or something and one of them got too close and died from the tiger. The tiger was then executed. It was an endangered tiger too.

[Blizzard]

That's exactly what I meant with the term "inhuman". I agree, human cruelity knows no limits. =/
And I mean what do you expect? When you make an animal suffer, it remembers it. It will rather attack you before you attack it again, it's more self-defense than revenge.

[Rune]

A group of drunk teenagers/young adults were nearby a tiger cage or something and one of them got too close and died from the tiger. The tiger was then executed.

It was most likely angry that it was in a cage. Animals like open spaces, and animals kept in cages get very distressed. In my opinion, Zoos should be used for endangered species only, as an attempt to get them back on their feet.
The tiger should have been taken back to it's respective country and not executed. What's the point in killing a member of an endangered species when you can just release it into the wild away from Humans?

[Starrodkirby86]

A group of drunk teenagers/young adults were nearby a tiger cage or something and one of them got too close and died from the tiger. The tiger was then executed.

It was most likely angry that it was in a cage. Animals like open spaces, and animals kept in cages get very distressed. In my opinion, Zoos should be used for endangered species only, as an attempt to get them back on their feet.
The tiger should have been taken back to it's respective country and not executed. What's the point in killing a member of an endangered species when you can just release it into the wild away from Humans?

They had to shoot it, if I can remember from that article. I'll dig it up, just wait.

Found it...apparently it was a San Francisco Zoo not San Diego. Same place though. :V That tiger looks cute.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tatiana_(tiger)

[Rune]

Send the bastard back home then, what's the point in more senseless killing?

[Fantasist]

The point? Society. The kid died, and the parents and anyone who can take advantage of the situation to get some publicity make a big deal out of it, though they give no shit about the kid. What do the authorities need to do? They prevent a publicity nightmare and kill the tiger. But it's a good thing that animal supporting numbers and organizations are increasing, they would've definitely thought twice before killing the tiger.

About the morality, I don't think it exists. Morality is an illusion, and it definitely won't help animals. I'm not against killing animals for food. Remember, not everyone can turn vegetarian. There are places in this world where meat is more easily available than plants and stuff. But I'm definitely against cruelty. But tell me this, how do you know the animals are aware of it, or have a problem with it? Don't get me wrong, but they aren't aware of their situation, or if they are, they sure as hell don't show it by going berserk or something. I don't know what is right, because nothing like that exists. I'm against cruelty to animals, but it won't mean a thing unless majority go with it. Many people don't care, that's where the problem is. But the real problem is, those who claim to care, how would they react if it really works? That's a tough question for me. Just imagine one week where no meat is available in the market, no matter what you tried. I don't know how the situation will be anywhere else, but where I live, people would become very agitated.

As for experimenting and hunting for fun, again, there's no morality for me. For all I know, there is no such thing as a moral right. Any being can do something if it can do something, it's as simple as that. If torturing animals gives a sick bastard fun and he can do it without getting into trouble, of course he does it. But I don't like that, I. It's my opinion. If I were to come across that person, I'd return the pain a 100 times over. So bottom line, cruelty can be stopped if majority stand for it, and seriously. I sure as hell don't like animal torture. But seriously, tell me this: how many times have any of you swat insects to death or killed cockroaches or set mouse traps? They ARE animals and I'd really like to know about this. I have killed many pests and what gave me the right to kill it just because it annoyed me? But I still did it, and I have no answer if someone asks me about it. How many of you have a good answer?